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Comments 96301 to 96350:

  1. CO2 lags temperature
    Muon, I believe he's referring Figure 1, where the peak of the current interglacial appears more extended along the x-axis than the previous interglacials, which look more like a sudden increase, and an equally sudden decrease. I assumed this was due to greater resolution the closer we got to the present.
  2. It's cooling
    127 Notsure, Its being defended because the full body of evidence supports AGW. Conversely, there are no supported studies demonstrating otherwise. Contrary to popular skeptic belief, natural causes are not being ignored. Please read the post on Is there a scientific consensus on global warming?
  3. It's cooling
    Notsure (#127) This entire website is a "reasoned defensive debate" of the science behind AGW.
  4. They changed the name from 'global warming' to 'climate change'
    I believe this article could be improved by adding an explanation of how scientists define the "Climate System" and that the acceleration of the greenhouse effect due to mankind's activites impacts all of the components of the "Climate System" not just the atmosphere.
  5. Climate's changed before
    While wild climate change has preserved a delicate balance of gasses called the atmosphere and has been very good for life on this planet, human caused climate change is new, and scientists agree it will soon upset that balance and have catastrophic consequences for human life.
  6. It's cooling
    DSL 'Climate science is receiving greater scrutiny than perhaps any other area of science' I hope so and so it should. True enquiring minds welcome scrutiny. However, whenever I see people defending global warming and especially mans influence on it, I fail to see reasoned defensive debate. Personal attacks and labeling them as deniers only stiffels debate.
  7. It's cooling
    JMurphy 'So far the sceptics seem to be more open''Do you have any examples you can give and link to' Prof Bob Carter James Cook University, Queensland. He has strong views on the subject that are worth listening to. From there you can search for many others. All come from different angles but unfortunatly if they dare to question global warming, even if they agree its happening they are labeled deniers. As far as cranks are concerned I have views and I will leave you to judge others.
    Moderator Response: Type "Bob Carter" without the quote marks into the Search field at the top left of this page.
  8. It's cooling
    'Remember: if we ignore this problem and it turns out the scientists are all wrong, then all this will be over within a decade, and heads will roll. Such a hoax couldn't last long with new generations of researchers coming on line. If scientists are right, and the observed warming continues, and we ignore it when we had a chance to do something about it, then we will and should be damned daily by our children and grandchildren.' I agree, however it is far more than the scientists reputations at stake (on both sides of the argument). If global warming is continuing and is caused by CO2 and poses a threat I agree we should take action. If not and global cooling increases in pace. (We are in a interglacial period within an iceage remember). This may be wasted effort. If we are heading for dangerous cooling instead of dangerous warming we may harm our ability to adapt by wasting precious time. I feel that we are not taking sufficient action to prevent global warming through our actions. Nor are we taking sufficient steps to check that understanding of climate change is correct. Labeling critics as deniers only builds barriers between the two sides of the argument. If you are convinced that warming is the only danger and have supported all available measures to reduce the risk then sleep well at night. If we ignore the posibility that we have misunderstood and have labeled CO2 as a danger and have damaged our ability to feed and warm ourselves we will pay the price. Whatever action we take we must test it on the way and be prepared to adapt or change course if we are in error.
    Moderator Response: We are not heading into a new ice age anytime soon. That is several tens of thousands of years away, as explained on the post "We’re heading into an ice age" and the comments there.
  9. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    #7: "a clear rise in these extreme weather events" Isn't it remarkable that the insurance industry is taking the lead in recognizing that things are changing? Similar observations made on the weird weather thread.
  10. Hurricanes aren't linked to global warming
    #36: "no one addressed Maue's work" See #34 and links therein.
  11. CO2 lags temperature
    #277: "the apparent flattening of temperature for the past few thousand years" This statement has no obvious meaning to me. As I asked on Are we heading into an ice age?, please define what you mean - use that thread and provide some source for this notion. Off topic comments have a way of disappearing, especially after several attempts at re-direction.
  12. Monckton Myth #10: Warming in the Pipeline
    barnErubble - The phrase "in the pipeline" has been an issue, because of the easy misinterpretation. See the terminology discussion on the Case Study of a Climate Scientist Skeptic thread. There is warming that has occurred and the measurement thereof (Trenberth has been concerned about poor measurements of ocean temperatures, in particular deep ocean temps and calibration issues - while fairly recent, and with ongoing calibration issues, they don't match what we expect in all respects). It seems possible that much of the energy is in the deep ocean, but that's an issue of ongoing investigation. And there is unrealized warming; the warming that has to happen to remove the current radiative imbalance. The latter is what is normally referred to as "in the pipeline" - it's not heating that is hiding under a bush somewhere, but rather hasn't occurred yet but will unless the radiative imbalance is removed. It's heat accumulating in the rather large thermal inertia of the oceans - it takes a long time for a small imbalance to warm a large ocean. The Earth has to heat by a certain amount for IR leaving the atmosphere to equal the energy coming in. And of course, if we continue to increase the radiative imbalance with CO2, global warming will continue to play catch-up, and continue to rise.
  13. citizenschallenge at 04:29 AM on 12 February 2011
    Hurricanes aren't linked to global warming
    regarding the graph @18 Global Tropical Cyclone Accumulated Cyclone Energy (ACE) according to Dr. Ryan N. Maue at the Florida State University: I was disappointed that no one addressed Maue's work and using Atlantic ocean stats does little to address his claim regarding Northern Hemisphere being at a 30 year ACE low. Any insights would be appreciated.
  14. Crichton's 'Aliens Cause Global Warming'
    RSVP, Do you have anything besides worthless wordplay to offer? Playing the victim does no benefit to your credibility. "The planet" is the surface temperature readings, while the stratosphere is the upper atmoshphere readings. Your apologies would be acceptable if there was any merit in them.
  15. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    Great article John, I had no idea that you ere doing that until I received me weekly email from the Guardian. yes, quite a few misguided comments, but when I last looked reason and science were persevering. I agree with authors that the improved moderation at The Guardian has helped in keeping the threads focussed and forcing people to speak to the science and not go on ideological rants. they should be commended for that-- because in the past, that is a loophole that the "skeptics" have taken advantage of. What people like Ken simply fail to understand is that their repeated claims that what we are witnessing is merely natural variability is a clever distraction, and misses the point. Yes, climate varies, we all know that, especially the climate scientists. But evidence has shown that even in the last 30 years or so the return period for severe events around the globe has been contracting and that there has been a discernible shift towards more extremes. We do not have to breaks records each and every year for there to be problems. What Ken et al. also forget is that 200-300 years ago there was practically no infrastructure and there were most definitely not even close to the number of people on the planet that there are today-- so even small shifts beyond what society has developed its infrastructure in can have marked consequences. Before, planning for a one-in hundred year event may have covered the bases, that is not going to be sufficient in the coming decades. And as for Australia I encourage people to please read this paper by Gallant and Karoly (2010, J. Climate) in which they conclude: "Australian extremes are examined starting from 1911, which is the first time a broad-scale assessment of Australian temperature extremes has been performed prior to 1957. Over the whole country, the results show an increase in the extent of hot and wet extremes and a decrease in the extent of cold and dry extremes annually and during all seasons from 1911 to 2008 at a rate of between 1% and 2% per decade. and "However, the trends from 1911 to 2008 and from 1957 to 2008 are not consistent with these relationships, providing evidence that the processes causing the interannual variations and those causing the longer-term trends are different." Yes, something very different is going on alright.
  16. CO2 lags temperature
    Thank you for the references. I have been frustrated in my attempts to find any real answers to my questions. Especially the apparent flattening of temperature for the past few thousand years as opposed to the normally rapid drop off; and the lack of the elimination of the northern ice cap as has occurred in past end of inter-glacial cycles. Hopefully there are answers here somewhere. Any suggestions?
  17. Monckton Myth #10: Warming in the Pipeline
    RE: dorlomin "The 'in the pipeline' phrase is often misused to suggest it is stored in the oceans (well by the less well educated contrairians), . . ." I take it that you believe Kevin Trenberth to be among the, 'less well educated contrairians'? Or is it just the phrase, 'in the pipeline' that should not be used to define the theory of stored heat in the Oceans? And Kevin is talking about vast amounts of heat being stored in the Oceans (albeit yet to be detected/found). Kind Regards, -Peter
  18. Crichton's 'Aliens Cause Global Warming'
    #37 "the planet has warmed at +0.16 degrees per decade... at the same time as the stratosphere has cooled " The stratosphere is part of the planet, so here you are saying it has warmed and cooled in the same sentence. Based on the other things youve directed to me, I am clearly at fault for not undertanding what you really mean. Please accept my apologies.
    Moderator Response: RVSP, unless you want your posts deleted, stop this tedious word play immediately. There is no contradiction there, merely a slight ambiguity (#37 should have specified "surface temperatures" instead of "planet"), however the intended meaning was obvious to anyone at all familiar with the debate. Even if that were not the case, it is still possible for the planet to warm overall while some part cools, it just means that some other part was warming faster than the average. Your pedantry is of no value, so please desist.
  19. It's cooling
    Notsure: "Get it right because time and money is being spent." Climate science is receiving greater scrutiny than perhaps any other area of science, excepting evolution. There are massive lobbying dollars being spent in the U.S. to discredit the science--and this lobbying is not based on an alternative theory that explains the instrumental record. It is simply an attack to stop legislation that might help mitigate the developing problem, because the legislation will hurt particular industries. If you want to be convinced, then do the math yourself. If you can't or won't do the thinking, then you're always going to rely on people you think you should trust, and they're always going to have power over you. That's fine--it's necessary sometimes. Yet who do you trust? Climate scientists, who don't really roll in the dough and don't have a vested interest in a warming planet (other than having to live in it)? Or pundits and big oil-financed lobbyists whose interests are not scientific but simply in achieving legislative or political effects, whatever the means? At least try to understand the basic mechanisms involved. Go over to scienceofdoom.com and do some brain sweating. The comment "A little picky, rebounding, reflecting or absorbsion and re-emission" is custom made for a ticket to SoD. Remember: if we ignore this problem and it turns out the scientists are all wrong, then all this will be over within a decade, and heads will roll. Such a hoax couldn't last long with new generations of researchers coming on line. If scientists are right, and the observed warming continues, and we ignore it when we had a chance to do something about it, then we will and should be damned daily by our children and grandchildren.
  20. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    Arkadiusz Semczyszak, why do you post part of an article (?) from the "Polish press" ? What do you think that adds ? It's certainly not connected to the link you do give, so it would be good if you could make clear what you are trying to get across. muoncounter, I think it is obvious by now that 'natural' and what can be attributed to 'natural' will be extended by the so-called skeptics as 'natural' becomes less and less 'natural' in the real world. As will the length of time we will supposedly have to wait before thinking about doing anything, just to make sure 'natural' is not possibly measured in hundreds, thousands, hundreds of thousands, even millions of years. I can see it coming : "It could be a natural event on a million-year time-scale ! Prove 100% it isn't !!"
  21. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    #5: "we should recognize that we realy don't know the limits of what is 'natural' and what is not." KL actually makes a salient point despite his obvious intent. Here is a partial list of what passes for 'natural' these days: -- Heat wave in Europe (2010), following the heat waves in 2007, 2006, 2003; models show increasing frequency of future heat waves. -- Hundred year drought in the Amazon (2002-2005) followed by 2010's even more severe drought. -- Devastating flooding followed immediately by a cat 5 cyclone in Queensland: the largest tropical storm to strike Australia since Europeans first settled there. -- Four cat 5 and one cat 4 Atlantic hurricanes in 2005. -- Four cat 4 Atlantic hurricanes in 2008. -- Extreme precipitation events suggesting an increased frequency of the heaviest events with warming, several times larger than the expected Clausius–Clapeyron scaling That our global climate system is changing is undeniable; the limit of what is fast becoming the new natural is what we do not know.
  22. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    Ken Lambert #5, insurance is a competetive industry and insurance companies have an interest in getting the risks right. If one company is claiming that climate change is increasing risk and so raise their premiums, another company, if they believe climate change is not occuring, will simply undercut these prices. Munich Re's database of weather-related loss events shows a clear rise in these extreme weather events, which they state cannot be explained fully without acknowledging climate change. Increasing population denisity and better reporting also increase the loss, but on their own this is not enough to explain the trend. The trend in non-weather-related losses, such as volcanic events, is not rising in line with weather-related loss.
  23. Arkadiusz Semczyszak at 01:33 AM on 12 February 2011
    Climate Change Impacts on Ocean Ecosystems
    „extreme denialist blog” - maybe you're right that it is "extreme denialist blog. " I hate extremists on both sides. But this blog in a focused, make absolutely basic knowledge about photosynthesis. Only part of the comments are too tendentious. “... CO2 intake is restricted by water loss ...” The increase in CO2 reduces the number of stomata and their opening times - reducing the consumption of water for plant growth. This is basic knowledge - I can not see the needs of citation of sources. Warming does not mean dry. In very warm Holocene optimum of the Sahara was flourishing oasis of greenery - is also a basic knowledge - I can not see the needs of citation of sources.
  24. Arkadiusz Semczyszak at 01:12 AM on 12 February 2011
    Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    In the Polish press is given very bad information for Australia. Not citing sources, says that: "Australian scientists studying coral reefs - increases over the last 3000 years - they realized that long periods of peace are separated by a few-teenage periods of rapid change. Australia is likely to wait until a few years so violent natural disasters. " The fact that the reefs are an excellent "barometer" of climate change in the past, can be found here: Response of coral reefs to climate change: Expansion and demise of the southernmost Pacific coral reef, Woodroffe et al., 2010.
  25. It's cooling
    #119: "A little picky, rebounding, reflecting or absorbsion and re-emission. Technically it may be different but simplified its the same." There is a huge difference between reflection and absorption/re-emission. Clouds, ice/snow, atmospheric dust, etc reflect a portion of the sun's energy back into space; this energy is then not available to heat the planet. On the other hand, energy that is absorbed at the earth's surface, to be re-emitted as infrared as the surface warms, is at the heart of greenhouse warming. "Weather and climate are a result of mechanisms that no scientist fully understands" Not really. In the utmost simplification, weather is planet's local, temporary response to differential heating and moisture conditions. Climate is the long term average and trend of this response. "The global warming debate is driven by models. The sceptics seems to be driven by history." Most science is driven by models these days. Models make complicated systems easier to describe and understand. And models are driven by history, because they must include past behavior. What you call 'skeptics' (more likely to be what we call deniers) are driven by neither. You'll find they often just make things up, take items out of context and try to explain by gross over-simplification. Please do take advantage of the tremendous amount of information available here. Read the Newcomers Guide, the Big Picture and then start working your way through the Most Used Arguments. Put 'what you've heard' and 'what it seems to be' on hold, so you can learn from the science. As Bibliovermis suggests, find the appropriate threads for comments and questions.
  26. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    In all these discussions of weather disasters, we should recognize that we realy don't know the limits of what is 'natural' and what is not. In the Brisbane flood 2011, the hydrologist who oversaw the planning of Wivenhoe dam was quoted in the 'Australian' thus: "When John Oxley discovered Brisbane 180 years ago, the local Aboriginal people were very agitated about flooding and they showed him high water marks that would have been 12m". The 1893 floods were just over 8.0m and Brisbane 2011 was 4.5m - and 1974 flood 5.5m. Given there are many changes to the population and roads, roofs, surface vegetation since 1824 - however these probably worsen the runoff and increase flood heights. On a world wide scale - weather disasters are supposed to be getting worst according to sources like insurers. Well they would say that wouldn't they?? Bigger disaster - bigger premium next time. No doubt payouts are getting larger - because areas are more densely populated and properties are much more developed, expensive, complex and larger in advanced countries. More people have insurance due to the explosion in mortgage lending and compulsory insurance, and the documentation of disasters is far better due to satellite pictures, and better communications. Anyway - who is going to argue with Aboriginal history about the Brisbane river being naturally subject to a 12m flood? I bet not too many of you are game.
  27. Captain Pithart at 23:43 PM on 11 February 2011
    Smoking, cancer and climate change
    I would also include the 2005/2007/2010 Amazon droughts as examples.
  28. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    Enjoyed the article, John, and the recent change in Guardian moderation policy has improved the discussion to a large extent! Cheers - John
  29. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    Try this http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/blog/2011/feb/09/australia-extreme-weather-flooding-drought Fixed link [muoncounter]
  30. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    the "click here to read the rest" link don't work
    Response: Oops, sorry, fixed!
  31. Smoking, cancer and climate change
    I like the idea of this post, but the execution could be improved upon imo. The question "did A cause B" is not really answerable for a probabilty issue. The odds can increase. E.g. the question: "Were the devastating floods in Queensland caused by climate change? Quite possibly but not certainly." implies that the answer is either yes (possibly but not certainly) or no. But that's not true I think. The answer is probably that the odds of such an event have increased due to the increased climate forcing, but there's not yes or no answer to the posed question. See also here re extreme weather and climate change.
  32. Guardian article: Australia's recent extreme weather isn't so extreme anymore
    http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2011/02/10/3135509.htm Australian researchers studying corals off the coast of Queensland have found the frequency of extreme rainfall events has increased over the past 100 years. just added that to the coments thread.
  33. It's cooling
    Notsure - so far the points you have made are show you are skeptical because you are uninformed as to what the data is and what is known or unknown. Now I agree with science being always skeptical - a constant search for errors and alternative explanations. However, real skepticism has be actually informed and climate pseudo-skeptics are mostly put down because they trot out long-debunked disinformation to support agendas not founded on data. Feel fdels, but theree to propose alternative mo
  34. It's cooling
    Notsure wrote : "Weather and climate are a result of mechanisms that no scientist fully understands or could ever fully explain." Does it matter ? Does any scientist fully understand the workings of Evolution or how the universe was created ? By the way, weather forecasts are invariably right these days, up to a certain number of days, so someone somewhere must know what they're doing. Notsure wrote : "The majority are sceptical because any sign of sceptism is put down by those promoting the theory of man made global warming." Can you give some reasonable examples, with regard to that "majority" and those being "put down" ? Notsure wrote : "The global warming debate is driven by models." No. I think you should have a look at a page on here that gives an outline of what we know and gives more links : The Big Picture Notsure wrote : "The sceptics seems to be driven by history." Do you have any examples you can give and link to ? Notsure wrote : "So far the sceptics seem to be more open (not the cranks, there there are many on both sides)." Do you have any examples you can give and link to ? Who would you class as the "cranks" on both sides ? You can give your answers on either of the links Bibliovermis gives, or find one of your own by searching this site.
  35. It's cooling
    Skepticism quickly becomes denial when the proper reasoned arguments are rejected on the basis that they conflict with preconceived notion. People's sense of "untruth" is based on emotion. If you truly are interested in learning about this scientific field, please read through this site & follow the primary source links for more reading material. Please respect the moderation of this site, which keeps it a civil place for discussing science. References to religion are not helpful. The global warming debate is driven by models. The sceptics seems to be driven by history. Please continue these discussions on the threads that already exist for these topics. They are both linked in the box at the top left corner titled "Most Used Skeptic Arguments". #5: Models are unreliable #2: Climate's changed before
  36. It's cooling
    A little picky, rebounding, reflecting or absorbsion and re-emission. Technically it may be different but simplified its the same. Weather and climate are a result of mechanisms that no scientist fully understands or could ever fully explain. All the references highlighted in the response have benn exhaustively shown unfortunatly there still remain sceptics. Science is forged on sceptism. Sceptics form science if no questions are posed no answers are found. The majority are sceptical because any sign of sceptism is put down by those promoting the theory of man made global warming. Unless proper reasoned arguments are given people will sense untruth. I hope i have an open mind. I hear non scientists but listen to scientists and expect reasoned argument. The global warming debate is driven by models. The sceptics seems to be driven by history. Where the conflict seems to come is where the history is questioned. So far the sceptics seem to be more open (not the cranks, there there are many on both sides) If the world is warming and we are heading for problems then understand the sceptical viewpoint and use them to refine the argument. To continue to put down critism smells of a shaky religion not confident of its facts. Get it right because time and money is being spent. If it is in the right areas then ok but if not then beware we are driving ourselves in the wrong direction. The planet is our responsibility at the moment which we hand to our children. Our children will judge us in turn.
  37. Climate Data for Citizen Scientists
    Thank you for this compilation. If I use this how should I refer to this? Anyway I'm not planning to publish anything based on this in a serious scientific journal so the WUWT style of reference (i.e. none credible) might be enough?
  38. Monckton Myth #10: Warming in the Pipeline
    Good :) A thought came to me, and perhaps this is where he gets the 57% figure - about 1.4˚C is expected from a climate sensitivity of 3˚C and current CO2 levels, and 0.8˚C has been realized. Guess what 8/14 is?
  39. Monckton Myth #10: Warming in the Pipeline
    I personally would be interested in knowing where Monckton came up with the 57% figure - the IPCC doesn't seem to use any numbers similar to that at all: http://www.ipcc.ch/publications_and_data/ar4/wg1/en/spmsspm-projections-of.html Unless they cited such 'warming in the pipeline' figures in another section. They do discuss here though that even if 2000 levels were kept, we'd expect a temperature increase of ~0.3-0.9 (likely 0.6) degrees Celsius by 2100. Monckton's claim of 0.4˚C at most is barely defensible within that range - the 0.4˚C part at least, not the "at most." Good article Dana, as always; one error though, just grammatical: second to last paragraph, I think "fod" should be "for."
    Moderator Response: [DB] Fixed text; thanks!
  40. Smoking, cancer and climate change
    #62: "Those who continue to question AGW ... are now victims of a "Climate Denial Machine???" No, the victims of the CDM will be those who've become the targets of US Republican-controlled Congressional committees. Starting with the EPA's efforts to regulate CO2.
  41. Smoking, cancer and climate change
    As a point of interest for those who may not know, Richard Lindzen, the MIT climate skeptic, has testified in court that the link between smoking and cancer is due to bad statistics. He is a very heavy smoker. Occasionally people note his belief that smoking does not cause cancer to show that his Climate opinions are not believable.
  42. Crichton's 'Aliens Cause Global Warming'
    "Furthermore, it does this with or without mankind's help, as it has for eons and eons, given that in reality it is a natural process...ironically." Oh, that old canard again, RSVP? Seriously, don't you get bored with this repetitive cut & paste approach? As has already been pointed out to you-ad infinitum-the existence of past, non-anthropogenic climate change, does not rule out the existence of anthropogenic climate change-any more than the existence of naturally occurring forest fires rules out the existence of arson. Comprende RSVP? When you & your fellow denialists can show us a *natural* mechanism for how the planet has warmed at +0.16 degrees per decade (the fastest rate in at *least* the last 10,000 years) over the last 30 years, in spite of declining TSI, at the same time as the stratosphere has cooled significantly, then maybe you'll be adding to the "sum of knowledge & learning". Recently, though, the only thing you've contributed to is the systematic dumbing down of this blogsphere-with your repetitive pseudo-scientific nonsense & your incessant persecution complex.
  43. Monckton Myth #10: Warming in the Pipeline
    I used the term "in the pipeline" simply because it's a commonly-used phrase (but true that it's often misunderstood). It simply refers to the unrealized warming from the CO2 we've already emitted, and is unrealized because of the thermal inertia of the oceans. enSKog - good catch, I corrected the reference to Scenario B1.
  44. Monckton Myth #10: Warming in the Pipeline
    Text just above the figure should refer to B1, not B2. The 'warming in the pipeline' idea always seemed to me too open to interpretation. It is the 'CO2' in the pipeline that is the problem.
  45. Monckton Myth #10: Warming in the Pipeline
    The 'in the pipeline' phrase is often misused to suggest it is stored in the oceans (well by the less well educated contrairians), curious to see Monckton effectively argue this as thermal inertia. I am also fairly sure part of the "in the pipeline" is assumed to be non CO2 positive forcings masked by atmospheric particles such as sulphates and the like, so in theory as we clean our emissions while we lose positive forcing from black carbon we decrease the negative forcing from particulate pollution (I am wandering a touch here to be fair)
  46. Smoking, cancer and climate change
    JohnR, Ah ha! moments of scientific revolution (unsettling settled science) come from presenting evidence, not from asking the same question a hundrededth time because the presenter didn't like the answer received the previous 99 times. Indignation is an emotional plea.
  47. Smoking, cancer and climate change
    JohnR wrote : "The science is never settled." Who said it was ?
  48. CO2 lags temperature
    stevenwv wrote : "What facts would you like verified?" Well, let's start with the first paragraph of that previous post of yours : "It is undeniable that we have yet to reach the 100,000 year interglacial temperature peaks." What figures/data can you link to, to show those "undeniable...100,000 year interglacial temperature peaks" ? You can reply on the following thread : Are we heading into a new ice age ? "CO2 is constantly absorbed and released from the oceans and is the obvious simultaneous prime emitter and absorber of CO2." What figures/data can you link to, to show the oceans currently being "the obvious simultaneous prime emitter and absorber of CO2" ? You can answer on : CO2 is coming from the ocean
    Moderator Response: Stephen, when JMurphy wrote "you can answer" on specific other threads, he/she really means you must, or your answer likely will be deleted from this thread, where your answer would be off topic.
  49. Smoking, cancer and climate change
    Those who continue to question AGW, accepting full well that there is GW and A have played a part, are now victims of a "Climate Denial Machine???" (#59) This site is in danger of becoming Skeptical of Science and an enqiring mind. Please stick with the science, not the emotion. A quote from Lonnie Thompson, "It's amazing how science works: you labour and you labour and you learn things that don't fit and don't make sense, and suddenly you get a piece of information from some far corner of the world and it makes you say, 'Hey, your paradigm was wrong, you didn't understand how the system worked'". The science is never settled.
  50. Smoking, cancer and climate change
    Jonathan Bagley wrote : "Also, why would the "deniers" invent the phrase "climate change"." "Climate change" is less frightening than "global warming". As one focus group participant noted, climate change "sounds like you’re going from Pittsburgh to Fort Lauderdale." While global warming has catastrophic connotations attached to it, climate change suggests a more controllable and less emotional challenge. Luntz memo, 2003

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